This week’s readings were very inspiring. The Apostle Paul in Romans 5 expressed how Adam’s sin had affected the human race. But God’s counter-act of love through Christ had brought man back to life once again. I was deeply moved by this chapter to see the amazing grace of God. He had freely given to man what he does not deserve because he had left God on his own free will. But the Apostle summed up God’s love very well by saying; v8 “But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.” For this reason man can only be justified by faith in the redeeming sacrifice of our Lord Jesus Christ because through His obedience to death, man is “made righteous” [v19]. Whidden in the sixth chapter of his book tells us that despite the mixtures of theological teachings in the days of Ellen White but her understanding of salvation in regards to sin and human condition was very clear. Interestingly, Ellen White saw that it is impossible for a man to work his way out from the slavery of sin because he inherit a sinful nature but not the guilt of Adam’s sin. For this reason, she concluded that man’s work is never enough to make him justify but only Jesus’ saving merits that is able. Angel M Rodriguez’s article “Comments on, 1 Timothy 4: 10” was helpful to clarify some of these difficult texts which seem to entertain the idea of universal justification. He stated that God offered a way of salvation for all man because Christ is the only “mean” and “exclusive instrument” for our salvation. However, in order to be justified by the Blood of Jesus and be saved is man’s acceptance of this precious gift. And all these readings really connect with our class discussion this week. I must say that Dr Hanna’s idea of “Salvation in Body language and Typology” was an eye opener. I often read these texts before but never got to think how Scripture is using the body language to explain the mystery of salvation. Again, I still agree with our class that we need a bigger model of salvation, must be based on Totality of Scriptures and must be seen through “His flesh” or the “Cross of Jesus” for better understanding of God’s saving grace.
The article justification by faith, but judgement by works in the BRI was very interesting. The article puts it very clearly that the two are intertwined and cannot be separated.We are justified bt grace, just because Christ died for us on the cross. His death, justifies us to have live if we only beleive in Him and do what He wants us to do. To add on that, if we are christians, we should show it by our own actions, and so, we shall be judged by our own action. That is why the books shall be opened, and the so that everyone to receive according to their own actions.
Chapter nine in the book of Romans, chapter nine, talks about God choosing His people, those who do according to His will. Those who follow God, by faith, shall be justified.Romans 9:25"I will call them my people, who are not my people; and i will call her my loved one, who is not my loved one." Chapter nine of the Book 'salvation', deals justification by faith. Ellen White stated that, though we are justified by faith, we should not take sin lightly. If we take sin lightly, then we will forget to obey our Master, and how different shall we be from those who belong to the world? True submision to our saviour, is the key for us to be one with our father in heaven.Her conclusion is that, justification by faith was closely related to a proper attitude on the part of believers toward sin, God's requrement,and His merciful arttitude toward the faithful. The artitude of humility and not of self-righteousness, will enable us to be justified by faith.
In the BRI, the article in Romans 3:21, talks about justification. It says that, we are justified, beside the law. The law cannot save us even if we obeyed it from morning till evening, we shall never be saved by the law. What then sall save us? The article contineus to say that, we are not saved by the law, but the blood of Jesus that was shed at the cross, justifies us.
Chapter 10 of the book of Romans stated the following-Romans 10:1 "Brothers, my heart's desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved", God calls us each and everyday,that we may come unto Him, and get life, in full abundance.
Ellen White Ministry after Miniapolis was so important. He empasised on Holyness and perfection, and mentioned that, the teaching concerining these two shall-not be exessively emotional, must always involve an understanding of objective justification by faith alone in the grace and merits of Jesus, must always be presented and be promoted in adventist seting, finally, must always involve the obedience to the ten commandments.
In class, we found out that, God has a part to play, and human beings also have a part to play. God call us, and gives us grace. We must work with our God, if we are to inherit His kingdom. Our cooperation with Him, will make the difference with those who do not coorperate with Him.
In the BRI, the article in Romans 3:21, talks about justification. It says that, we are justified, beside the law. The law cannot save us even if we obeyed it from morning till evening, we shall never be saved by the law. What then sall save us? The article contineus to say that, we are not saved by the law, but the blood of Jesus that was shed at the cross, justifies us.
Chapter 10 of the book of Romans stated the following-Romans 10:1 "Brothers, my heart's desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved", God calls us each and everyday,that we may come unto Him, and get life, in full abundance.
Ellen White Ministry after Miniapolis was so important. He empasised on Holyness and perfection, and mentioned that, the teaching concerining these two shall-not be exessively emotional, must always involve an understanding of objective justification by faith alone in the grace and merits of Jesus, must always be presented and be promoted in adventist seting, finally, must always involve the obedience to the ten commandments.
In class, we found out that, God has a part to play, and human beings also have a part to play. God call us, and gives us grace. We must work with our God, if we are to inherit His kingdom. Our cooperation with Him, will make the difference with those who do not coorperate with Him.
The article in BRI-Salvation by faith- was very good.It reminded us that, it is not about us, But our God who is in heaven. He will do all and all in us if we beieve. Paul talks about it. That salvation is all about grace and faith. Justifiacaion begins with faith and ends with faith, we as human beings have nothing to do, aprt from following our master as He leads. Infact, our walk involves only by faith, for sometimes we do not inderstand it all.
The book of Romans 11 says that, it is all about grace. Romans 11:6 "And if by grace then, it is no longer by works;, if it were, grace would no longer be grace. It is all about grace, and no one deserves it, beouse we have all sinned. In chapter 11 of her book -Salvation-, Ellen White addresses the significance and meaning of Minneapolis and 1888. She can in no wise be charged with doing away with the authority of God's law and the redeemed person's obligation to obey it in grace. She did not denigrate subjects related to obedience, but clearly sounded a clarion note that God's people will not be able to move forward intheir Christian experience unless they have a clear view of the assurance of His marvelous acceptance through Christ's justifying merits.
In class we discussed the issues that, if we accept the offer, that is when we can be justified, and so, no one will be forced to go t heaven, unless they corperate with the preparation of God.
In the BRI, artical on 'Legal universe justification' cought my eyes. It illustrates the fact that all human race has been justified legally. The justication happened when Jesus took away our penalty for death and gave us eteranl life. After Adam simnned, the penalty was for him to die. Death was a consequence of man's disobedience to God, but Jesus died for humanity instead. The death of Jesus on the cross was not ment for one person, but the whole universe, hence the universe is justified trough the sheding of blood on the cross. The book of Romans 12:2 warns us. "do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be trasformed by the renewing of your mind .." Once we have known that we have been saved by grace, let us then be obedient to God, so that we maybe transformed.
Chapter 12 of -Salvation, Ellen White says that, the close relationship between law and gospel, faith and works, and the expression that sinners are saves from sin, not in sin, continued with undiminished force during late 1888-1892, after Minneapolis. The balance between justification and sancification that had been in her understanding from the aerliest days was not denied.
From class, we learnt that, those who are justified, are sanctified. The just by faith are renewed each and everyday.
"Some theological consideration for perfection", a topic in the BRI, was challanging to me. According to that article, perfection does not mean, ceasing from sin. We are human beings, with human nature, and so,how do we become perfect in our sinful nature? Our God is perfect, and so, can we become perfect just as our faher in heaven is perfect? The perfection that is talked about is that of growing in our character, to imitate the character of God. 1 cor.12:20, warns us not to continually be childlike, eating childich food. We should grow and imitate God more and more each and every day, and that is what is refered to as perfection.If we thirst and hunger for righteous, then we shall be filled, hence being made perfect.
The book of Romans 13, urges us to be faithfull to the authorities and to be submissive to them. If we obey those who we see, then that is when we can obey our God who we do not see. If we owe the state anything, then we should give it back-if taxes, if respect, and so we are told give every body what they deserve not becouse of anything but becouse our father wants us to do so. If we are true christians, the we are told to love one another, and so bydoing that, we will be perfect as our father in heaven is perfect. Romans 13:8"Let no debt remain outstanding, except the contining debt to love one another, for he who loves his fellow man has fulfilled the law."
In her book 'Salvation' chapter 12, Ellen White says that, righteousness certaily is active in the soul of the believer to target righteous acts and character.She empasised on the importance of obedience throughout her ministry. If we are justified by faith, then we should obey the voice of God.
Justification should lead us to obey our master, hence perfection.
As I reflect on my reading the document on “The Dynamics of Salvation” I could relate why we need to have a bigger concept of Salvation and Sin. I agree with our discussion in class that we need to have a deeper and wider view of sin and Salvation. As I think of how the act of sin has robed my own life of many peaceful and productive days, it helps me desire to see the sin problem bigger and be glad to share with others that the Salvation is even a bigger gift from God. I am willing to learn more about how deep and wide sin is and how Salvation had to match it to get us out of our lost state. As I read the section on the “Humanity’s Desperate Need” and how we are alienated from our true selves, and from one another and created world I thought to myself how can I dare get up in the morning and think I have ever given my all to Christ, but how important that today I give myself all over again. During my time of reflection our discussions in class and the reading other’s have written on their view of Salvation it helps me to know that every day is a new day only given to me by God and that there is nothing I can do alone that can give me nor allow me to keep my Salvation. It is only because of the two terms we have been using in class that my Salvation is assured. The state of passive we discussed was brought out well when the writer drew from the Bible in John 6:44 “”No one can come to Me, unless the Father who sent Me draws him. . .” Then the author talks about the Holy Spirit empower our wills as he awakens us to long for God. So true is the Bible when it states we can do nothing without God. Of course, I can’t leave out the state of being active we discussed after we are drawn by the Holy Spirit and we are lead to see the need to repent, then our part comes in when we become sorry for our sins and still using the passive state as we are helped to desire to turn away from sin and do the will of God. Passive begins the process and from what I can see it walks along even during our active state. Wow! Even as I learn through the reading and our discussion the different ways of Salvation through justification, reconciliation, forgiveness, adoption, sanctification, and others one of the ways really sticks out in my mind the author brought up a point I hadn’t looked at before. Using the way of Salvation through sanctification the author brought out that usually this word is used by Christians to say we are growing within our life time toward the divine ideal. But the author brought out the Bible says it is a “new status” we are given. Now I can better understand why we get uneasy when people refer to us as saints or sanctified ones, because we don’t understand what the way of sanctification really does for us. In class we discussed at the point of my accepting Salvation I am fully perfect but growing continually I am still in my new status.” Praise the Lord! Without the reflection of how I can be assured I am saved my actions everyday can cause me to doubt my Salvation. The author puts it well when it was stated from a quote of Ellen White that uses the Bible as a reference as well; “Not only has God in Christ made the once-for-all sacrifice for our sins, but we now have a great High Priest in the heavenly sanctuary, where He ever lives to make intercession for us and to send forth timely help from the throne of grace” (Heb. 7:25; 4:16; Selected Messages, book 2, pp. 32, 33) Paraphrasing a statement of an Alcoholic “Once a sinner always a sinner, but every day clean (intercession) causes me to be a recovering sinner.
This text does not teach new doctrine to followers of Christ; rather it reaffirms and shed greater light on the role that faith plays in our journey in following Jesus Christ. It is important to note that faith results in justification, without it, the goal is unreachable. No matter, the length or the width of our works, it is to naught, without faith. Justification and salvation are forever interlinked. They are however, not a means to an end. The finish line starts and ends with faith. We, as a people have to realize that our efforts towards salvation are not a line drawn in the sand where God does His part and we do ours, interaction is paramount. Faith is an attainable goal. As with any goal, there is a method from one point to the next. It involves having a plan, understanding the rules and means of progression. We know who God is, and what He means to our lives. WE know what the ultimate sacrifice was, and what we have to do to receive it, to insure that said sacrifice was not meaningless to us. We have a Perfect example, of how we can live life and who to honor. We must understand that following that blueprint takes faith in who we are following, because if we look at our contribution we would faint. It is important to keep in context faith origin. It is biblical. Without faith it is impossible to please God we are told, and we are told it is like a child that has faith in their parents guiding them to a certain end in life that is for their good. Even as we use a flashlight in the dark to follow a path, we use Jesus as our example, to keep us on the road that leads to eternity with God. Ellen White was on target, when she stated, “It is not enough to believe about Christ; we must believe in Him” We must know without a shadow of the doubt, that the road to the Cross, was only a rest stop, the road leading away from the cross is the light at the end of the tunnel.” Faith and obedience, in truth, go hand in hand. You cannot have one; without the other. When you accept the one, you have a duty to the other. It entails surrendering oneself, but the reward is worthy of such a method. Obedience entails trust. We trust the one that we give obedience to guide us in the right direction; to minister to our needs; and to have our best interest at heart. Without faith, there is no hope. Without hope, there is nothing to have faith in. What keeps us on the path that leads to salivation is not an object that touches our five senses. It is a promise that was made and shown through Jesus’ example as He had faith His Father would receive His sacrifice on the cross after He had taken our sins upon Himself and became sin for us and died the penalty we should die. Faith and hope are verbs that demand action. We cannot stand still, with them in our mind. We have to press forward, to meet our destiny. In class we discussed how we need faith to accept the mysteries we can’t explain but believe. Last by not least I didn’t agree with the author when the statement was made after the quote that Paul made about “none righteous no, not one,” author says “because we are unrighteous, we are strangers to God.” I don’t believe that the God that created me sinless and then made away for me to be reconciled to himself counts me as a stranger. Yes, I believe my relationship has been estranged because of my sins but through Jesus I have been accepted back as his child.
There have been many arguments concerning the spirit of the law and the written law. I have often tried to marry the two in a wholistic approach that fits both sides; the Spirit is the Law but more than the Law. Christ said, “You have heard it said…But I tell you…” In short, Christ doesn’t throw away the law but raises the bar. This is the obvious response many give to new believers or legalists. Moreover, I add that Christ comes through the law, and goes beyond it by reaching a higher standard of living; not of obedience for the purpose of obedience, but a law of love for the purpose of a new relationship with Christ; in short fulfilling the law. I enjoyed the new paradigm Hanna shared in his handout with the class, “The letter of the Spirit and Law” because it quotes Paul speaking to this argument through the eyes of Israel as national (law) and international (spirit). It seems fitting how Paul describes God’s involvement through Israel to accomplish His work in law (national) and spirit (international). The point I found enlightening was how the law was a ‘tutor’ before Christ came to us Gal. 3:23-26. I have either looked over this or forgotten its truth in our day for application. It really does answer a lot of questions so we can understand what it means to keep the Law in Spirit and in Truth. It gives such a beautiful picture of what the function of the Law is and does for us without having to use many texts and quotes to prove our point how one is right or wrong. If I would preach this, I would title it, “Law, the servant of Christ.”
Response to Leonora Salvation by faith 9/30/10 Amen Sister. I found it paramount how you paralleled faith to our relationship to our parents when we were children; we need faith to survive! Moreover, faith and obedience go hand in hand as does law and grace; you don’t have faith if it doesn’t work because it shows you don’t believe; and you can’t keep the law if you don’t have the grace of Jesus’ Christ sacrifice. Yet, we don’t know what grace is unless we have a law. Faith is such an intricate part of the puzzle when it comes to salvation and it should never be isolated in our new relationship to Christ. Ellen White says, “Salvation is a conglomerate of doctrines” and I feel she is correct. Moreover, we don’t even have our own faith; it is given to those by God who believe.
Paul gives a foundational argument in Romans 5 for Salvation in Jesus Christ because he goes to the very beginning of humanity. By stating Jesus as type of Adam, he is claiming our release from the bondage of sin if we accept His sacrifice. Furthermore, I’m glad EGW distinguishes what she means by this ‘sin’ in Whidden’s book. He quotes her writings by saying sin has two parts: “acts of transgressing God’s will and a condition of depravity that involves inherited sinful propensities” (Whidden, 41). I see this colored with justification and sanctification. Though we cannot have a righteousness in our own doing, it is Christ who’s blood comes and makes us righteous because of our faith in Him; justification. Furthermore, our acts of loving response (or faith working through love Gal. 5:6) are our journey for a lifetime for sanctification.
I hear what you’re saying. This faith that we claim for justification is a beautiful thing. Though, sometimes, we can take it too lightly. I have often done it myself. We forget the reason for this ‘justification’ and say, “I’m justified” and continue with our lives. For some it has become of term of endearment. What I’m saying is that we cannot forget the reason for this justification. Why are we justified? What’s the purpose of it all? Some might argue, so, I’m justified, now what? Someone who truly understands what it means to be justified wouldn’t be asking that question because they know what justification is for. It is our righteousness which Christ imputes on us to reestablish a union that was lost in Eden. This is none other than sin. We cannot forget the ugliness of sin. If we do, we will cease to remember where we came from; our Exodus from a prior slave master. Moreover, we may want to go back to our spiritual slave master (Egypt) if we forget where we are going. In other words, we cannot forget where we came from as EGW would say, “We have nothing to fear except that we forget how God has lead us in the past.” Moreover, our focus isn’t to be on sin and it’s ugliness but on Christ. This is the issue of Grace and Law, sin and salvation; you can’t have one without the existence of the other in the Great Controversy. We need justification, but we also need to remember why we have it and move on in our renewed lives in Christ.
Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. It opened your eyes to something you would never have experienced elsewhere. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.” When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; I found it difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Yes, it was an interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week and then gave into shrimp, fish, and others. I could see how they were trying and I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I was seeing the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb. It was heart-gripping. The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; and our late night tea drinking, long trips during the day, and extensive conversations in the mornings about my family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back again soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul makes this issue of knowledge (which Adventists claim to have) and prophecy (which we claim to have) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it is only partial; no matter how much we have of it. Paul then speaks on what’s really important and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter 9/11/2007 8:14 AM Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. It opened your eyes to something you would never have experienced elsewhere. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; I found it difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Yes, it was an interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week and then gave into shrimp, fish, and others. I could see how they were trying and I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I was seeing the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb. It was heart-gripping.The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; and our late night tea drinking, long trips during the day, and extensive conversations in the mornings about my family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back again soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul makes this issue of knowledge (which Adventists claim to have) and prophecy (which we claim to have) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it is only partial; no matter how much we have of it. Paul then speaks on what’s really important and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter 9/11/2007 8:14 AM Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. It opened your eyes to something you would never have experienced elsewhere. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; I found it difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Yes, it was an interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. I could see how they were trying and I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I was seeing the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb. It was heart-gripping. The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; and our late night tea drinking, long trips during the day, and extensive conversations in the mornings about my family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back again soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul makes this issue of knowledge (which Adventists claim) and prophecy (which we claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it is only partial; no matter how much we have of it. Paul then speaks on what’s really important and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter 9/11/2007 8:14 AM Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; I found it difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Yes, it was an interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. I could see how they were trying and I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I was seeing the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb. It was heart-gripping. The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; and our late night tea drinking, long trips during the day, and extensive conversations in the mornings about my family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back again soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul makes this issue of knowledge (which Adventists claim) and prophecy (which we claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it is only partial; no matter how much we have of it. Paul then speaks on what’s really important and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter 9/11/2007 8:14 AM Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; It was difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I saw the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb; heart-gripping. The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; late night tea drinking and extensive conversations in the mornings about family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul mentions the issues of knowledge and prophecy (what Adventists claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it’s partial; no matter how much we have. Paul then speaks on what really matters and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter 9/11/2007 8:14 AM Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; It was difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I saw the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb; heart-gripping. The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; late night tea drinking and extensive conversations in the mornings about family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul mentions the issues of knowledge and prophecy (what Adventists claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it’s partial; no matter how much we have. Paul then speaks on what really matters and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on its own, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. Yet as adults (of mature standing), we will put foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter 9/11/2007 8:14 AM Wow, I am so sorry but glad for your experience where they tried to convert the ‘Adventist’ pastor at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my gf meeting her parents; It was difficult to communicate for obvious reasons. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. We took the bullet train to historical sites like Hiroshima/Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt for war when I saw half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists) pictures of people with bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb; heart-gripping. I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; late night tea drinking and extensive conversations in the mornings about family; I realized how much we have in common. point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul mentions the issues of knowledge and prophecy (what Adventists claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it’s partial; no matter how much we have. Paul then speaks on what really matters and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on its own, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. Yet as adults (of mature standing), we will put foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
nancy thomas my reflection of romans chapt 2: wow Paul is hitting on a lot of things in this chapter. First he tells me that no one has any business judging anyone else. Most of the time when we call ourselves judging other, we too are doing the same things. Isn't that ironic, because many who stand and criticise others are generally the one's who believe "do as I say and not as I do". as if they are not accountable for there actions as well. Paul say's that we are accountable and the very ones that are judging will have to stand in front of God one day and take accountability for their actions, God has no favorites. It reminds me of the scripture "if you love me you will keep my commands" which say's to me that my love for Christ is shown by my action toward him, that when i just say the words and not do them, it counts for nothing.
nancy thomas my reflection on the decade before 1888 and romans 3: I will begin by telling this story of my early beginnings in the adventist church. there was a older member there (I will call her Mrs. Adams) well every wednesday after prayer meeting i would always offer her a ride home because on my way home i use to pass by her house. after we got in the car and settled it would never fail that she would go through her list of things she did not do. like eat meat with blood, or any meat for that matter, or swear, and i've been going to church and keeping the sabbath for 50 odd years, and the list would go on. then she would always tell me, i've reached perfection because i don't sin. in my own mind i would always think well that sounds very contrary to what the bible say's because Paul say's that there is none without sin no not one, and we all fall short of the glory of God. Ellen White seemed to have touched on this same issue in the discription of fantical brother B. It is easy for us to think that we have reached perfection because maybe we don't do the very noticable sins like adultry, fornication, stealing, or even murder. But the bible also tells me that even our thoughts are sinful. And many times it is hard for us to tell Jesus we are sorry for our sins, because we don't believe we are sinners. It is funny because E.G.W came to the conclusion that we in our inability to sin are not even able to keep the laws of God, because we are to prone to our sinful nature. But she nor does Paul ever leave us hopeless Praise the Lord! if we yield our selves over to the glorious master who died for us (Jesus!) through him are we able to not sin, and obey God. thank you Jesus!!!!
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This week’s readings were very inspiring. The Apostle Paul in Romans 5 expressed how Adam’s sin had affected the human race. But God’s counter-act of love through Christ had brought man back to life once again. I was deeply moved by this chapter to see the amazing grace of God. He had freely given to man what he does not deserve because he had left God on his own free will. But the Apostle summed up God’s love very well by saying; v8 “But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.” For this reason man can only be justified by faith in the redeeming sacrifice of our Lord Jesus Christ because through His obedience to death, man is “made righteous” [v19]. Whidden in the sixth chapter of his book tells us that despite the mixtures of theological teachings in the days of Ellen White but her understanding of salvation in regards to sin and human condition was very clear. Interestingly, Ellen White saw that it is impossible for a man to work his way out from the slavery of sin because he inherit a sinful nature but not the guilt of Adam’s sin. For this reason, she concluded that man’s work is never enough to make him justify but only Jesus’ saving merits that is able.
Angel M Rodriguez’s article “Comments on, 1 Timothy 4: 10” was helpful to clarify some of these difficult texts which seem to entertain the idea of universal justification. He stated that God offered a way of salvation for all man because Christ is the only “mean” and “exclusive instrument” for our salvation. However, in order to be justified by the Blood of Jesus and be saved is man’s acceptance of this precious gift. And all these readings really connect with our class discussion this week. I must say that Dr Hanna’s idea of “Salvation in Body language and Typology” was an eye opener. I often read these texts before but never got to think how Scripture is using the body language to explain the mystery of salvation. Again, I still agree with our class that we need a bigger model of salvation, must be based on Totality of Scriptures and must be seen through “His flesh” or the “Cross of Jesus” for better understanding of God’s saving grace.
The article justification by faith, but judgement by works in the BRI was very interesting. The article puts it very clearly that the two are intertwined and cannot be separated.We are justified bt grace, just because Christ died for us on the cross. His death, justifies us to have live if we only beleive in Him and do what He wants us to do. To add on that, if we are christians, we should show it by our own actions, and so, we shall be judged by our own action. That is why the books shall be opened, and the so that everyone to receive according to their own actions.
Chapter nine in the book of Romans, chapter nine, talks about God choosing His people, those who do according to His will. Those who follow God, by faith, shall be justified.Romans 9:25"I will call them my people, who are not my people; and i will call her my loved one, who is not my loved one."
Chapter nine of the Book 'salvation', deals justification by faith. Ellen White stated that, though we are justified by faith, we should not take sin lightly. If we take sin lightly, then we will forget to obey our Master, and how different shall we be from those who belong to the world? True submision to our saviour, is the key for us to be one with our father in heaven.Her conclusion is that, justification by faith was closely related to a proper attitude on the part of believers toward sin, God's requrement,and His merciful arttitude toward the faithful.
The artitude of humility and not of self-righteousness, will enable us to be justified by faith.
In the BRI, the article in Romans 3:21, talks about justification. It says that, we are justified, beside the law. The law cannot save us even if we obeyed it from morning till evening, we shall never be saved by the law. What then sall save us?
The article contineus to say that, we are not saved by the law, but the blood of Jesus that was shed at the cross, justifies us.
Chapter 10 of the book of Romans stated the following-Romans 10:1 "Brothers, my heart's desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved", God calls us each and everyday,that we may come unto Him, and get life, in full abundance.
Ellen White Ministry after Miniapolis was so important. He empasised on Holyness and perfection, and mentioned that, the teaching concerining these two shall-not be exessively emotional, must always involve an understanding of objective justification by faith alone in the grace and merits of Jesus, must always be presented and be promoted in adventist seting, finally, must always involve the obedience to the ten commandments.
In class, we found out that, God has a part to play, and human beings also have a part to play.
God call us, and gives us grace. We must work with our God, if we are to inherit His kingdom. Our cooperation with Him, will make the difference with those who do not coorperate with Him.
In the BRI, the article in Romans 3:21, talks about justification. It says that, we are justified, beside the law. The law cannot save us even if we obeyed it from morning till evening, we shall never be saved by the law. What then sall save us?
The article contineus to say that, we are not saved by the law, but the blood of Jesus that was shed at the cross, justifies us.
Chapter 10 of the book of Romans stated the following-Romans 10:1 "Brothers, my heart's desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved", God calls us each and everyday,that we may come unto Him, and get life, in full abundance.
Ellen White Ministry after Miniapolis was so important. He empasised on Holyness and perfection, and mentioned that, the teaching concerining these two shall-not be exessively emotional, must always involve an understanding of objective justification by faith alone in the grace and merits of Jesus, must always be presented and be promoted in adventist seting, finally, must always involve the obedience to the ten commandments.
In class, we found out that, God has a part to play, and human beings also have a part to play.
God call us, and gives us grace. We must work with our God, if we are to inherit His kingdom. Our cooperation with Him, will make the difference with those who do not coorperate with Him.
The article in BRI-Salvation by faith- was very good.It reminded us that, it is not about us, But our God who is in heaven. He will do all and all in us if we beieve. Paul talks about it. That salvation is all about grace and faith. Justifiacaion begins with faith and ends with faith, we as human beings have nothing to do, aprt from following our master as He leads. Infact, our walk involves only by faith, for sometimes we do not inderstand it all.
The book of Romans 11 says that, it is all about grace. Romans 11:6 "And if by grace then, it is no longer by works;, if it were, grace would no longer be grace.
It is all about grace, and no one deserves it, beouse we have all sinned.
In chapter 11 of her book -Salvation-, Ellen White addresses the significance and meaning of Minneapolis and 1888. She can in no wise be charged with doing away
with the authority of God's law and the redeemed person's obligation to obey it in grace. She did not denigrate subjects related to obedience, but clearly sounded a clarion note that God's people will not be able to move forward intheir Christian experience unless they have a clear view of the assurance of His marvelous acceptance through Christ's justifying merits.
In class we discussed the issues that, if we accept the offer, that is when we can be justified, and so, no one will be forced to go t heaven, unless they corperate with the preparation of God.
In the BRI, artical on 'Legal universe justification' cought my eyes. It illustrates the fact that all human race has been justified legally. The justication happened when Jesus took away our penalty for death and gave us eteranl life. After Adam simnned, the penalty was for him to die. Death was a consequence of man's disobedience to God, but Jesus died for humanity instead. The death of Jesus on the cross was not ment for one person, but the whole universe, hence the universe is justified trough the sheding of blood on the cross.
The book of Romans 12:2 warns us. "do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be trasformed by the renewing of your mind .." Once we have known that we have been saved by grace, let us then be obedient to God, so that we maybe transformed.
Chapter 12 of -Salvation, Ellen White says that, the close relationship between law and gospel, faith and works, and the expression that sinners are saves from sin, not in sin, continued with undiminished force during late 1888-1892, after Minneapolis. The balance between justification and sancification that had been in her understanding from the aerliest days was not denied.
From class, we learnt that, those who are justified, are sanctified. The just by faith are renewed each and everyday.
"Some theological consideration for perfection", a topic in the BRI, was challanging to me. According to that article, perfection does not mean, ceasing from sin. We are human beings, with human nature, and so,how do we become perfect in our sinful nature? Our God is perfect, and so, can we become perfect just as our faher in heaven is perfect?
The perfection that is talked about is that of growing in our character, to imitate the character of God. 1 cor.12:20, warns us not to continually be childlike, eating childich food. We should grow and imitate God more and more each and every day, and that is what is refered to as perfection.If we thirst and hunger for righteous, then we shall be filled, hence being made perfect.
The book of Romans 13, urges us to be faithfull to the authorities and to be submissive to them. If we obey those who we see, then that is when we can obey our God who we do not see. If we owe the state anything, then we should give it back-if taxes, if respect, and so we are told give every body what they deserve not becouse of anything but becouse our father wants us to do so. If we are true christians, the we are told to love one another, and so bydoing that, we will be perfect as our father in heaven is perfect. Romans 13:8"Let no debt remain outstanding, except the contining debt to love one another, for he who loves his fellow man has fulfilled the law."
In her book 'Salvation' chapter 12, Ellen White says that, righteousness certaily is active in the soul of the believer to target righteous acts and character.She empasised on the importance of obedience throughout her ministry. If we are justified by faith, then we should obey the voice of God.
Justification should lead us to obey our master, hence perfection.
Lenora D. Muse
Doctrine of Salvation
As I reflect on my reading the document on “The Dynamics of Salvation” I could relate why we need to have a bigger concept of Salvation and Sin. I agree with our discussion in class that we need to have a deeper and wider view of sin and Salvation. As I think of how the act of sin has robed my own life of many peaceful and productive days, it helps me desire to see the sin problem bigger and be glad to share with others that the Salvation is even a bigger gift from God. I am willing to learn more about how deep and wide sin is and how Salvation had to match it to get us out of our lost state. As I read the section on the “Humanity’s Desperate Need” and how we are alienated from our true selves, and from one another and created world I thought to myself how can I dare get up in the morning and think I have ever given my all to Christ, but how important that today I give myself all over again. During my time of reflection our discussions in class and the reading other’s have written on their view of Salvation it helps me to know that every day is a new day only given to me by God and that there is nothing I can do alone that can give me nor allow me to keep my Salvation. It is only because of the two terms we have been using in class that my Salvation is assured.
The state of passive we discussed was brought out well when the writer drew from the Bible in John 6:44 “”No one can come to Me, unless the Father who sent Me draws him. . .” Then the author talks about the Holy Spirit empower our wills as he awakens us to long for God. So true is the Bible when it states we can do nothing without God. Of course, I can’t leave out the state of being active we discussed after we are drawn by the Holy Spirit and we are lead to see the need to repent, then our part comes in when we become sorry for our sins and still using the passive state as we are helped to desire to turn away from sin and do the will of God. Passive begins the process and from what I can see it walks along even during our active state. Wow!
Even as I learn through the reading and our discussion the different ways of Salvation through justification, reconciliation, forgiveness, adoption, sanctification, and others one of the ways really sticks out in my mind the author brought up a point I hadn’t looked at before. Using the way of Salvation through sanctification the author brought out that usually this word is used by Christians to say we are growing within our life time toward the divine ideal. But the author brought out the Bible says it is a “new status” we are given. Now I can better understand why we get uneasy when people refer to us as saints or sanctified ones, because we don’t understand what the way of sanctification really does for us. In class we discussed at the point of my accepting Salvation I am fully perfect but growing continually I am still in my new status.” Praise the Lord!
Without the reflection of how I can be assured I am saved my actions everyday can cause me to doubt my Salvation. The author puts it well when it was stated from a quote of Ellen White that uses the Bible as a reference as well; “Not only has God in Christ made the once-for-all sacrifice for our sins, but we now have a great High Priest in the heavenly sanctuary, where He ever lives to make intercession for us and to send forth timely help from the throne of grace” (Heb. 7:25; 4:16; Selected Messages, book 2, pp. 32, 33) Paraphrasing a statement of an Alcoholic “Once a sinner always a sinner, but every day clean (intercession) causes me to be a recovering sinner.
SALVATION BY FAITH
Jan Paulsen
This text does not teach new doctrine to followers of Christ; rather it reaffirms and shed greater light on the role that faith plays in our journey in following Jesus Christ. It is important to note that faith results in justification, without it, the goal is unreachable. No matter, the length or the width of our works, it is to naught, without faith.
Justification and salvation are forever interlinked. They are however, not a means to an end. The finish line starts and ends with faith. We, as a people have to realize that our efforts towards salvation are not a line drawn in the sand where God does His part and we do ours, interaction is paramount.
Faith is an attainable goal. As with any goal, there is a method from one point to the next. It involves having a plan, understanding the rules and means of progression. We know who God is, and what He means to our lives. WE know what the ultimate sacrifice was, and what we have to do to receive it, to insure that said sacrifice was not meaningless to us. We have a Perfect example, of how we can live life and who to honor. We must understand that following that blueprint takes faith in who we are following, because if we look at our contribution we would faint.
It is important to keep in context faith origin. It is biblical. Without faith it is impossible to please God we are told, and we are told it is like a child that has faith in their parents guiding them to a certain end in life that is for their good. Even as we use a flashlight in the dark to follow a path, we use Jesus as our example, to keep us on the road that leads to eternity with God. Ellen White was on target, when she stated, “It is not enough to believe about Christ; we must believe in Him” We must know without a shadow of the doubt, that the road to the Cross, was only a rest stop, the road leading away from the cross is the light at the end of the tunnel.”
Faith and obedience, in truth, go hand in hand. You cannot have one; without the other. When you accept the one, you have a duty to the other. It entails surrendering oneself, but the reward is worthy of such a method. Obedience entails trust. We trust the one that we give obedience to guide us in the right direction; to minister to our needs; and to have our best interest at heart.
Without faith, there is no hope. Without hope, there is nothing to have faith in. What keeps us on the path that leads to salivation is not an object that touches our five senses. It is a promise that was made and shown through Jesus’ example as He had faith His Father would receive His sacrifice on the cross after He had taken our sins upon Himself and became sin for us and died the penalty we should die. Faith and hope are verbs that demand action. We cannot stand still, with them in our mind. We have to press forward, to meet our destiny. In class we discussed how we need faith to accept the mysteries we can’t explain but believe.
Last by not least I didn’t agree with the author when the statement was made after the quote that Paul made about “none righteous no, not one,” author says “because we are unrighteous, we are strangers to God.” I don’t believe that the God that created me sinless and then made away for me to be reconciled to himself counts me as a stranger. Yes, I believe my relationship has been estranged because of my sins but through Jesus I have been accepted back as his child.
Comment #4: Spirit and Law
There have been many arguments concerning the spirit of the law and the written law. I have often tried to marry the two in a wholistic approach that fits both sides; the Spirit is the Law but more than the Law. Christ said, “You have heard it said…But I tell you…” In short, Christ doesn’t throw away the law but raises the bar. This is the obvious response many give to new believers or legalists. Moreover, I add that Christ comes through the law, and goes beyond it by reaching a higher standard of living; not of obedience for the purpose of obedience, but a law of love for the purpose of a new relationship with Christ; in short fulfilling the law.
I enjoyed the new paradigm Hanna shared in his handout with the class, “The letter of the Spirit and Law” because it quotes Paul speaking to this argument through the eyes of Israel as national (law) and international (spirit). It seems fitting how Paul describes God’s involvement through Israel to accomplish His work in law (national) and spirit (international). The point I found enlightening was how the law was a ‘tutor’ before Christ came to us Gal. 3:23-26. I have either looked over this or forgotten its truth in our day for application. It really does answer a lot of questions so we can understand what it means to keep the Law in Spirit and in Truth. It gives such a beautiful picture of what the function of the Law is and does for us without having to use many texts and quotes to prove our point how one is right or wrong. If I would preach this, I would title it, “Law, the servant of Christ.”
Response to Leonora
Salvation by faith 9/30/10
Amen Sister. I found it paramount how you paralleled faith to our relationship to our parents when we were children; we need faith to survive! Moreover, faith and obedience go hand in hand as does law and grace; you don’t have faith if it doesn’t work because it shows you don’t believe; and you can’t keep the law if you don’t have the grace of Jesus’ Christ sacrifice. Yet, we don’t know what grace is unless we have a law.
Faith is such an intricate part of the puzzle when it comes to salvation and it should never be isolated in our new relationship to Christ. Ellen White says, “Salvation is a conglomerate of doctrines” and I feel she is correct. Moreover, we don’t even have our own faith; it is given to those by God who believe.
Response to Kolia Afamasaga
Reflection Paper #5 9/29/2008 5:40 PM
Paul gives a foundational argument in Romans 5 for Salvation in Jesus Christ because he goes to the very beginning of humanity. By stating Jesus as type of Adam, he is claiming our release from the bondage of sin if we accept His sacrifice. Furthermore, I’m glad EGW distinguishes what she means by this ‘sin’ in Whidden’s book. He quotes her writings by saying sin has two parts: “acts of transgressing God’s will and a condition of depravity that involves inherited sinful propensities” (Whidden, 41). I see this colored with justification and sanctification. Though we cannot have a righteousness in our own doing, it is Christ who’s blood comes and makes us righteous because of our faith in Him; justification. Furthermore, our acts of loving response (or faith working through love Gal. 5:6) are our journey for a lifetime for sanctification.
Response to ednah mak
Justification by faith 12/15/2008 8:40 AM
I hear what you’re saying. This faith that we claim for justification is a beautiful thing. Though, sometimes, we can take it too lightly. I have often done it myself. We forget the reason for this ‘justification’ and say, “I’m justified” and continue with our lives. For some it has become of term of endearment. What I’m saying is that we cannot forget the reason for this justification. Why are we justified? What’s the purpose of it all? Some might argue, so, I’m justified, now what?
Someone who truly understands what it means to be justified wouldn’t be asking that question because they know what justification is for. It is our righteousness which Christ imputes on us to reestablish a union that was lost in Eden. This is none other than sin. We cannot forget the ugliness of sin. If we do, we will cease to remember where we came from; our Exodus from a prior slave master. Moreover, we may want to go back to our spiritual slave master (Egypt) if we forget where we are going.
In other words, we cannot forget where we came from as EGW would say, “We have nothing to fear except that we forget how God has lead us in the past.” Moreover, our focus isn’t to be on sin and it’s ugliness but on Christ. This is the issue of Grace and Law, sin and salvation; you can’t have one without the existence of the other in the Great Controversy.
We need justification, but we also need to remember why we have it and move on in our renewed lives in Christ.
Response to Walter
9/11/2007 8:14 AM
Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. It opened your eyes to something you would never have experienced elsewhere. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”
When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; I found it difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Yes, it was an interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week and then gave into shrimp, fish, and others. I could see how they were trying and I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I was seeing the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb. It was heart-gripping.
The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; and our late night tea drinking, long trips during the day, and extensive conversations in the mornings about my family; I realized how much we have in common.
The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back again soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul makes this issue of knowledge (which Adventists claim to have) and prophecy (which we claim to have) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it is only partial; no matter how much we have of it. Paul then speaks on what’s really important and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter
9/11/2007 8:14 AM
Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. It opened your eyes to something you would never have experienced elsewhere. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; I found it difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Yes, it was an interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week and then gave into shrimp, fish, and others. I could see how they were trying and I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I was seeing the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb. It was heart-gripping.The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; and our late night tea drinking, long trips during the day, and extensive conversations in the mornings about my family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back again soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul makes this issue of knowledge (which Adventists claim to have) and prophecy (which we claim to have) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it is only partial; no matter how much we have of it. Paul then speaks on what’s really important and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter
9/11/2007 8:14 AM
Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. It opened your eyes to something you would never have experienced elsewhere. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; I found it difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Yes, it was an interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. I could see how they were trying and I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I was seeing the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb. It was heart-gripping. The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; and our late night tea drinking, long trips during the day, and extensive conversations in the mornings about my family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back again soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul makes this issue of knowledge (which Adventists claim) and prophecy (which we claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it is only partial; no matter how much we have of it. Paul then speaks on what’s really important and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter
9/11/2007 8:14 AM
Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; I found it difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Yes, it was an interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. I could see how they were trying and I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I was seeing the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb. It was heart-gripping. The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; and our late night tea drinking, long trips during the day, and extensive conversations in the mornings about my family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back again soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul makes this issue of knowledge (which Adventists claim) and prophecy (which we claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it is only partial; no matter how much we have of it. Paul then speaks on what’s really important and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter
9/11/2007 8:14 AM
Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; It was difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I saw the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb; heart-gripping. The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; late night tea drinking and extensive conversations in the mornings about family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul mentions the issues of knowledge and prophecy (what Adventists claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it’s partial; no matter how much we have. Paul then speaks on what really matters and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on it’s own, not irritable or resentful, bearing all things, believes all things, hopes all things, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, tongue speaking, understanding, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. But when we are adults (of mature standing), we will put these foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter
9/11/2007 8:14 AM
Wow, I am so sorry but also glad for your experience at the Evangelical Church where they tried to convert you (an Adventist pastor ) at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my girlfriend (at the time) meeting her parents; It was difficult to communicate because they only spoke Japanese. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. I thanked them. We took the bullet train across the country visiting historical sites like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt against war when I saw the half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists); pictures of people with their bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb; heart-gripping. The reason I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; late night tea drinking and extensive conversations in the mornings about family; I realized how much we have in common. The point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul mentions the issues of knowledge and prophecy (what Adventists claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it’s partial; no matter how much we have. Paul then speaks on what really matters and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on its own, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. Yet as adults (of mature standing), we will put foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
Response to Walter
9/11/2007 8:14 AM
Wow, I am so sorry but glad for your experience where they tried to convert the ‘Adventist’ pastor at their camp meeting. Quite the irony. I can relate, but I wasn’t shocked at your statement concerning our church, “the love and acceptance I've felt in their presence tends to be more than I get in 'logical minded' SDA gatherings.”When I was in Japan with my gf meeting her parents; It was difficult to communicate for obvious reasons. Moreover, L.’s father is a Buddhist priest! Interesting Christmas vacation. They knew I was vegetarian and accommodated my diet for the first week. We took the bullet train to historical sites like Hiroshima/Nagasaki. I will never forget the anger I felt for war when I saw half blown Dome (which they preserved for tourists) pictures of people with bones hanging, skin sagging, and blood dripping as their now deformed bodies would be forever changed by the Atomic bomb; heart-gripping. I mention this is because we often rip each others hearts and spirits apart when we feel we are more right than others which causes us to feel justified in our revenge towards them. Is this the gospel? After my 3 week visit with the family; late night tea drinking and extensive conversations in the mornings about family; I realized how much we have in common. point: When I left, L. told me that her family loved me and wanted me to come back soon. This reminds me of a quote: “Preach the gospel wherever you go, and when necessary use words.” –St. Francis of Assisi. Paul mentions the issues of knowledge and prophecy (what Adventists claim) but states that it will all pass away. Moreover, it’s partial; no matter how much we have. Paul then speaks on what really matters and describes it as patient, kind, not envious or boastful or arrogant or rude, not insisting on its own, and endures all things. A child is one who puts knowledge, prophecy, and yes even faith and conviction to give our lives for the glory of God above this one thing. Yet as adults (of mature standing), we will put foolish things away in light of God’s highest calling. Now! These remain faith, hope, and this, but the greatest of these is this; love!
nancy thomas my reflection of romans chapt 2: wow Paul is hitting on a lot of things in this chapter. First he tells me that no one has any business judging anyone else. Most of the time when we call ourselves judging other, we too are doing the same things. Isn't that ironic, because many who stand and criticise others are generally the one's who believe "do as I say and not as I do". as if they are not accountable for there actions as well. Paul say's that we are accountable and the very ones that are judging will have to stand in front of God one day and take accountability for their actions, God has no favorites. It reminds me of the scripture "if you love me you will keep my commands" which say's to me that my love for Christ is shown by my action toward him, that when i just say the words and not do them, it counts for nothing.
nancy thomas my reflection on the decade before 1888 and romans 3: I will begin by telling this story of my early beginnings in the adventist church. there was a older member there (I will call her Mrs. Adams) well every wednesday after prayer meeting i would always offer her a ride home because on my way home i use to pass by her house. after we got in the car and settled it would never fail that she would go through her list of things she did not do. like eat meat with blood, or any meat for that matter, or swear, and i've been going to church and keeping the sabbath for 50 odd years, and the list would go on. then she would always tell me, i've reached perfection because i don't sin. in my own mind i would always think well that sounds very contrary to what the bible say's because Paul say's that there is none without sin no not one, and we all fall short of the glory of God. Ellen White seemed to have touched on this same issue in the discription of fantical brother B. It is easy for us to think that we have reached perfection because maybe we don't do the very noticable sins like adultry, fornication, stealing, or even murder. But the bible also tells me that even our thoughts are sinful. And many times it is hard for us to tell Jesus we are sorry for our sins, because we don't believe we are sinners. It is funny because E.G.W came to the conclusion that we in our inability to sin are not even able to keep the laws of God, because we are to prone to our sinful nature. But she nor does Paul ever leave us hopeless Praise the Lord! if we yield our selves over to the glorious master who died for us (Jesus!) through him are we able to not sin, and obey God. thank you Jesus!!!!
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